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23 NOVEMBER 2014

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Cestrian
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Should Hatton fight again on Tue 5-May-2009:

Weight had f**k all to do with it.... Hatton is world class fighter (won 5 world titles at 2 weights) but he was in with one of the best PVP fighters of all time...
He was out classed...  Lets give credit to Pacman and not try and look at reasons why Hatton did not fire etc.

In answer to your question... You only have to look at the reaction of Hattons future wife at ringside when he was out cold and in big trouble to know Hatton should go right now while he can still spend his money with his health and his family. (just wish he had got out after his last fight)


Cestrian
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Great to get some different opions JeffSa1 - Funny thing is agree with how you described the fight happening only with his big brother.... (Haye signed to fight them both in a 3 fight deal) I think if Lewis could not shift him then i think Haye wont.

But I see Haye taking this one with the little brother because of that glass chin. Have you and the other Ozzie fight fans had much chance to see Haye in action ? I understand first hand that lot of British fights are not always shwon on Fox.

I think he will be a breath of fresh air to the world boxing scene. A huge cruiser weight that is fast as a super middle with chilling ko power. Slowly bulking up 2 stone as not to effect his speed.

I think the bigger he gets the better he will be able to take a shot. A lot is made of his Stopage loss to CT but if you get chance to watch that fight - you will see that Haye was a 6 round novice fighting a former world champion. He banged the crap out of him and had him out on his feet before he punched himself out and was stopped on his feet. I bet he looks back and think he learned more from the loss than if he got the stopage in the first.


Cestrian
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Well its the big one we have been waiting for......

Undisputed cruiserweight Champion David Haye looking to gate crash the heavyweight scene against Wladimir.

What will he Haye come in at weight wise ? 15 and half stone for speed and give nearly 2 and half stone away or bulk up to near 17 ???

Do we think Haye can get the big guy out of there ?
Or will Wlad hold off his foe for 4 rounds and then grind him down with that boring but efficient jab ?

My Gut feeling is a 16 stone Haye Ko him in 3 and get everyone talking about the big guys again.

So my betting tip is........Cover the first 4 rounds with a cover bet of Haye by Ko. For those who want to play on the safe side you can pcik him up for as good price as 9/4.

I don’t know how long his reign will be as he is also signed to fight his brother.....


Cestrian
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1980s Welterweights on Mon 6-Apr-2009:

Yep you have got me bang for rights.... 17 with bad spots. Wink.... My time machines come in handy though.

But that makes me a 17 year old thats made solid points twice that you have ignored in both your rsponses. My point is this... your list is covering whole of 80's.... Well duran was 7/8 years older than the fighter you mention. You have him at the bottom of your list and to give this credit you drag up fights he lost at higher weights up at middle weight 10 year past his prime....

When Duran first fought Leonard he was still just in his prime (so was Lenoard). He moved up from Lightweight champ (held it for 6 years smashing everyone before the days of 4 belts !) he had been only beaten once in 72 fights !!(avenged twice) and was unbeaten as pro.

I kow he made his name down there but.... He moved up to Welter and in his first fight he knocked the crap out of Leonard.... Yes Leonard fought the wrong fight but Duran was very very fast that night and able to close down the range and drag him into a war.

On their day both in the prime Duran won. "nd fight Duran rolled into the ring... Not leonards fault. No ones but Durans.... he as a shocking trainner and his weight gains mid fight took 2.3 years off his prime.



Cestrian
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I am more than happy close the discussion friendly without insulting.  Your quite right Opinions are opinions...

I think Joe has done enough by dominating at S/M before moving up and beating the man at L/H Bhop.
He picked up the Ring belt for that but more and more in recent years big fighters drop the belts to make the supper fights.

Everyone knows who the main man is at that weight, belts mean less and less and will continue to be devalued if the champs don’t try and fight each other to close out the division. Joe was the man at L/H after beating RJ and Bhop.

Having watched Joe for a long time ringside and on the box I can honestly say L/H was as big as he could go with his frame and fading KO power through problems with his hands.

He would get mashed up at C/W (even more so since they put the weight limit up half stone) a few years back and talk about him fighting Haye up at heavy.... well you just watch how hard the new 16 stone Haye bang in 2 months when he smashes 18 stone Wlad in 5.

Joe's dad (and trainer) once did an interview a few years back.... He said at the start of every training camp he gets the pads on and he has a good look at him to see if he is in decline. He said the minute he spots something they would have an honest chat.

Well at the end of the RJ fight/pay day his dad made it quite clear post fight straight away that was his last. Reading between the lines I think his dad new it had run its course.

He had nothing to prove getting in with fighter 4 stone bigger and 10 years younger he would have been just risking his health.

Time to go was now and he could do no more than rule at S/M and L/H. He joins Lenox going out when it was right with his feet up and health intact so he can enjoy his £ with his family. Good luck to him.


Cestrian
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Stop back tracking..... wiith your "I think i regard Calzaghe better than you do"

You have just started a thread full of you s**t canning every world champ he has beaten !

To quote some of your pearls of wisdom....

"Kessler is nothing more than a discrete fighter, in matter of historical fighter is a NOBODY."

And then my personel fav..

"Don t be ridicolous ! Jeff Lacy, ?? Who is him ? I would ko myself."

Then you go onto bang the drum that Joe will not go down as a great because he did not fight Chad.

I know styles makes fights but....Fact Chad Dawson was beaten by Glen Johnson but never got the nod.

Glen Johnson has beed beaten by Omar Sheika and Hopkins.... Both Joe Victims. You can also add to his list of Johnson beaters - Clinton Woods and Sven the protected Ottke who refused to get in the ring with him Joe but we all know what the outcome would have been as usre as night becomes day....

There will always be another fighter... the man can only fight who was put in front of him. Truth is yes Frank Warren was reluctant to through Joe in state side for peanuts, however no one wanted anything to do with him. Just to good.

You coulld keep pulling names of young new fighters at different weights out of the hat for the next 3 years until he looses...Time to go is now. Not when he has damaged his lagacy like the great RJ.

Kessler will go on to prove what a great victory that was... he would walk Chad & Johnson down and break them up.


Cestrian
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MaximilianoHe your a idiot !

Calzaghe in his time he has beaten 13 past and current world champs without been beaten. Yeah he could fight Chad but there will always be another fight....

I think if he was born on the otherside of the pond you would be singing a different tune.


Cestrian
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1980s Welterweights on Wed 25-Mar-2009:

Well put Number 1.

John Boy - Your little list sucks. Duran is right at the top of most peoples lists even at Welter.

I noticed you ignored/glossed over my points "As for the Points about Duran loosing to Benetiz and Hearns.... That was right up at light Middle - (Your post was about 1980's welters so why include these fights??) 7 years past prime.


Its also worth pointing out that although Duran fought Lenoard,Hearns, Haggler and co it was in fact way past peak. He was almost from another era. He was 7 years older than hearns, 7 years older Benetiz and 5 older than Lenoard......


Myself and Number 1 cannot educate you as you clearly have a closed mind and prefer to read stats off websites that read duran had "X" number of losses up at light middle 7/8 years later instead of watching those old great fights where he dominated for years and years..... well before Haggler and hearns really came on the scene.


Cestrian
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Anthony Mundine on Tue 24-Feb-2009:
I think most people agree - He is hand picking his fights with a saftey first approach. To build up his shi*ty record with the WBA

Whenever he has mixed it with world class fighters he has lost. END OF STORY
 
HE HAS GOT HIS TITLES BY WBA putting him as number 2 !  For FIGHTING LOCAL BAR FIGHTERS and WBA world tile holder winning other belt !!!  He HAS THEN PICKED HIS BELT UP OUT OF THE FLOOR  - CAN ANYONE SAY THAT IT A GOOD THING FOR BOXING !

If he finds himself in the ring with a live fighter (even a blown up old welter) he goes into back peddle fighter who looks 6 round amature fighter with only one 2 punch combo on the back foot to his locker - with a big mouth that talks a good fight.

Dont give me the oh he is learning and he is working to the big fights - he is nearly in his mid 30's and will soon be in decline.... his best years wasted... 

Thing is I think if had left Oz and gone to the states and worked with a top trainer like Roach and had a heart in the ring he could have mixed it with the best.

Thats a lot of IF'S....

He like been a big fish in a small boxing pond and to quote Green his heart is a big as a tic tac.


Cestrian
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1980s Welterweights on Thu 5-Feb-2009:
Dont agree with your number 7 ranking for Roberto Duran.... First off Durans best years were down at light Welter before he came up and smashed Ray Lenoard to pieces at welter.

Fact is Duran (well documented) was a bad trainer and used to blow up in between fights. So convincing was his first fight win he was never in the gym and he rolled into tht next fight with Lenoard and Ray got on his bike and ran/boxed...Until Duran quit....

But on their day when both were fully up for it in the first fight Duran was to fast and far to strong for him.... So in their primes.... duran was the better fighter even at welter, so why is he 7 places below the man.... I suggest you watch the first fight again ) . Put those fighers fit and in the prime 100 times Duran wins everytime.

As for the Points about Duran loosing to Benetiz and Hearns.... That was right up at light Middle - (Your post was about 1980's welters so why include these fights) years past prime.

Its also worth pointing out that although Duran fought Lenoard,Hearns, Haggler and co it was in fact way past peak. He was almost from another era. He was 7 years older than hearns, 7 years older Benetiz and 5 older than Lenoard......

Give the 4 weight world champion Hands of stone his due..... Its worth mentioning he knocked the crap out of Iran Barkley (the guy who Ko Hearns) up at Middle weight in the Ring Mag fight of the year... 8 years past his best...


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